Microsoft Kinect: infrared depth maps for dewarping?
Moderator: peterZ
- rob
- Posts: 773
- Joined: 03 Jun 2009, 13:50
- E-book readers owned: iRex iLiad, Kindle 2
- Number of books owned: 4000
- Country: United States
- Location: Maryland, United States
- Contact:
Microsoft Kinect: infrared depth maps for dewarping?
So apparently for US$150, you get a device that turns what it sees into a color image and a depth map via infrared. The infrared camera is apparently 320x240, which could be enough data to dewarp book images in real time? But first you might have to wait for the US$2000 bounty for an open-source driver to be claimed.
The Singularity is Near. ~ http://halfbakedmaker.org ~ Follow me as I build the world's first all-mechanical steam-powered computer.
-
- Posts: 596
- Joined: 06 Jun 2009, 23:57
Re: Microsoft Kinect: infrared depth maps for dewarping?
I dunno. I see this:
If I didn't already have a platen which pretty much flattens things for me, I'd probably be thinking along the lines of two cameras and a projected grid.
which (even at 1 cm accuracy) doesn't seem to me to be precise enough for viable dewarping.We have heard claims that the system can measure distance within 1cm of accuracy at two meters. While that's great in concept, early reviews are showing that you don't get anywhere near that accuracy in the real world—yet.
If I didn't already have a platen which pretty much flattens things for me, I'd probably be thinking along the lines of two cameras and a projected grid.
- daniel_reetz
- Posts: 2812
- Joined: 03 Jun 2009, 13:56
- E-book readers owned: Used to have a PRS-500
- Number of books owned: 600
- Country: United States
- Contact:
Re: Microsoft Kinect: infrared depth maps for dewarping?
I am of the opinion that it could be very useful for book scanning. A depth map takes any image-based guessing out of the equation. I'd love to see it tied to an ordinary SLR or something.
I will drop $100 on any open pot for Kinect hacking (you may see my comment on Adafruit to the same effect).
There are a lot of other ways to get a depth map, too. I have some in the works, but we should talk about some of that when we meet next week.
I will drop $100 on any open pot for Kinect hacking (you may see my comment on Adafruit to the same effect).
There are a lot of other ways to get a depth map, too. I have some in the works, but we should talk about some of that when we meet next week.
- daniel_reetz
- Posts: 2812
- Joined: 03 Jun 2009, 13:56
- E-book readers owned: Used to have a PRS-500
- Number of books owned: 600
- Country: United States
- Contact:
Re: Microsoft Kinect: infrared depth maps for dewarping?
Fact is, we can probably mod the thing to be "nearsighted" and spread all that resolution over a very thin section (meaning, the thickness of a book).
-
- Posts: 596
- Joined: 06 Jun 2009, 23:57
Re: Microsoft Kinect: infrared depth maps for dewarping?
If you're going that route, why not start with something like the GP2D120, which costs $15 and has a range of 2 to 12 inches? http://www.acroname.com/robotics/parts/ ... 2D120.html Maybe that's too close, but these systems come with different ranges. I don't know what the precision is, but I assume you could hook one up to some robotics to do up/down right/left scanning.daniel_reetz wrote:Fact is, we can probably mod the thing to be "nearsighted" and spread all that resolution over a very thin section (meaning, the thickness of a book).
I don't know if platen materials (acrylic, glass, or maybe someday Gorilla Glass) reflect IR or not. I'd think even with the information you need to do dewarping, the less of it you have to do, the better.
- daniel_reetz
- Posts: 2812
- Joined: 03 Jun 2009, 13:56
- E-book readers owned: Used to have a PRS-500
- Number of books owned: 600
- Country: United States
- Contact:
Re: Microsoft Kinect: infrared depth maps for dewarping?
Spam, I love ya man, but I don't think you're quite getting the idea of a depth camera -- it gives you per-pixel depth over the whole scene. Here's an example image: http://cache.gawkerassets.com/assets/im ... eos_97.jpg
Here's one rendered from a 3D environment, nice and clean: http://www.formz.com/forum2/messages/142/19101.jpg
I've used the Sharp thing you linked quite a few times at work. First off, it only gives you depth at a single point. Second, it's easily confused by all kinds of things, including IR from lights (nevermind what the datasheet says). They are noisy. They are confused by materials by different reflectances. I guess I COULD scan it across an entire book and slowly build up a depth map, but that would take forever-- the Kinect runs at 30fps! A bit faster than I can flip.
If you had a depth map of a page, you could dewarp it with just that information. You know I'm a platen guy -- if you can flatten it, do. But I also look forward to building book scanning systems that have nothing to do with the hardware we've been developing. In fact, I have some of them in a rough form, they're just not ready to be released quite yet.
Here's one rendered from a 3D environment, nice and clean: http://www.formz.com/forum2/messages/142/19101.jpg
I've used the Sharp thing you linked quite a few times at work. First off, it only gives you depth at a single point. Second, it's easily confused by all kinds of things, including IR from lights (nevermind what the datasheet says). They are noisy. They are confused by materials by different reflectances. I guess I COULD scan it across an entire book and slowly build up a depth map, but that would take forever-- the Kinect runs at 30fps! A bit faster than I can flip.
If you had a depth map of a page, you could dewarp it with just that information. You know I'm a platen guy -- if you can flatten it, do. But I also look forward to building book scanning systems that have nothing to do with the hardware we've been developing. In fact, I have some of them in a rough form, they're just not ready to be released quite yet.
Agreed, 100%... but there are a lot of situations in which a platen is just not ideal...I'd think even with the information you need to do dewarping, the less of it you have to do, the better.
-
- Posts: 596
- Joined: 06 Jun 2009, 23:57
Re: Microsoft Kinect: infrared depth maps for dewarping?
I'm sure that's true. I ran across the link I posted while looking for details on how the Kinect works.daniel_reetz wrote:I don't think you're quite getting the idea of a depth camera
Yeah, I've seen the video from Japan where they're scanning some Dick and Jane type book by flipping through it. It looks intriguing, but it's way beyond anything I ever expect to be able to build.daniel_reetz wrote:the Kinect runs at 30fps! A bit faster than I can flip.
Well, put me on the waiting list, and get back to work!daniel_reetz wrote:I also look forward to building book scanning systems that have nothing to do with the hardware we've been developing. In fact, I have some of them in a rough form, they're just not ready to be released quite yet.
-
- Posts: 496
- Joined: 04 Mar 2014, 00:53
Re: Microsoft Kinect: infrared depth maps for dewarping?
Not a bad deal for a home-use 3D scanner, granted we mod it to do more than the occasional Jazzercise game.
Here's that flipper/gamer-change/magic bottle of Sapporo:
They're drinking better beer in Japan. Or not drinking at all.
Here's that flipper/gamer-change/magic bottle of Sapporo:
univurshul wrote: Here's another technology to flipping & scanning that's gonna crush every hardware delusion of grandeur: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tCOXC5PTJj8&feature=fvw
They're drinking better beer in Japan. Or not drinking at all.
-
- Posts: 496
- Joined: 04 Mar 2014, 00:53
Re: Microsoft Kinect: infrared depth maps for dewarping?
...and what about this?:
http://blog.ponoko.com/2010/09/14/maker ... d-scanner/
A DIY 3D scanner? --Probably doesn't doesn't produce a scan rate as the Kinect
...Where are you guys getting your laser cutters?
http://blog.ponoko.com/2010/09/14/maker ... d-scanner/
A DIY 3D scanner? --Probably doesn't doesn't produce a scan rate as the Kinect
...Where are you guys getting your laser cutters?
- daniel_reetz
- Posts: 2812
- Joined: 03 Jun 2009, 13:56
- E-book readers owned: Used to have a PRS-500
- Number of books owned: 600
- Country: United States
- Contact:
Re: Microsoft Kinect: infrared depth maps for dewarping?
Yeah, I'm not sure the 3-phase stuff is the right way to go, and it's dependent on old hardware...univurshul wrote:...and what about this?:
http://blog.ponoko.com/2010/09/14/maker ... d-scanner/
A DIY 3D scanner? --Probably doesn't doesn't produce a scan rate as the Kinect
I won mine...univurshul wrote:...Where are you guys getting your laser cutters?